June 19th, 2012



That’s right Los Pollos Hermanos, it’s time to roll up your trousers and step into the shallow, but deadly waters of this week’s SILENCE!

Suddenly! The galaxy’s greatest podcasteers blunder into the hot SILENCE! news of the day covering the recent demi-knighthood of Sir Grant Morrison and Alan Moore’s recent tabloid controversy. Then it’s onwards, ever onwards with nary a thought for the safety of passers by, as they discuss Kane and Hike’s Bulletproof Coffin, AVX VS AXV no.whatever, Shade no.9, Planetoid, BatOwl, Amazing Spiderman, and finally Michel Fiffe’s terrific Suicide Squad love letter, Deathzone. Then, in an extended notcomics section Lactus talks up recent cinematic thing Prometheus, while the Beast tackles Game of Thrones and The Hunger Games books. Then it’s off to bed with the haunting sounds of The Beast’s song Aquaman: King Of The Sea.

It’s all jimmied into an hour and a half of solid bronze comics chat, all for you the beloved SILENCERS. So let’s all go down to the meadow to pray, worry about that good old way and get listening!

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36 Responses to “SILENCE! #18”

  1. Michel Fiffe » Post DEATHZONE! Says:

    [...] Ones had some really nice things to say about it upon my revealing the comic [Update: and after receiving it as well!]; they always come through with [...]

  2. Frank Says:

    There is a precedent of Thomas Wayne Jr. in the main DC universe, from 1974′s World’s Finest #223 and #227– His story was pretty similar as the one shown on Batman #10, as a baby he gets banged up in the head in a car accident, a doctor determines he’ll be mentally unstable (In Gotham, that always means “criminally insane”), so the Waynes put him in Willowwood Sanatorium, also the same that shows in #10. Years later he comes back and starts killing people with razorangs, as these things happen, until he’s stopped by Batman, Superman and Deadman. Morrison would later re-use him as Owlman’s alter ego on JLA: Earth-2. Also, back in Batman #702, he hinted that Thomas Wayne, Jr. might have been the real identity of Dr. Hurt (in fact, my money was on him :P), by showing Willowwood (now an) Asylum.

  3. Gary Lactus Says:

    There we are. Thank you for filling us in. Still a bit weird how the Waynes just left their kid in a sanatorium and forgot about him because a doctor says he’s mental.

  4. amypoodle Says:

    I love the irreverent review of GoT. Because it’s HBO, I think people are fooled into thinking it must possess the same kind of depth as the best of their output, when in fact it’s a new kind of show – big budget adventure flick mashed with soap… and a soupcon of the Sopranos. Not a very neat formulation, I know, but at least it’s a step along the road to an accurate definition. The books, as many have said already (and ad infinitum), are different, but you’re never going to read them so you’ve got to take the thing on its own merits. Don’t agree with you that the Dothraki are straightforwardly shit. They start that way, but by the end and the fire and the dragons and all that you should be totally down with them. Also: NO. Jorah Mormont is not a bloody exiled tribesman. That makes you look really silly. Even if his story wasn’t outlined on screen it would be as obvious as anything could be that he’s a Westerosi.

  5. Adam Says:

    The Dothraki are shit on the telly. Some of the Dany stuff isn’t, howevs.

  6. The Beast Must Die Says:

    I don’t remember who the Westerosi are. I know he wasn’t a disgraced Dothraki. Whatever, he’s still David Attenborough with a sword.

    I can only really remember the SeanBean clan, the posh blond ones that fuck each other… Like I say, I watched it in a big splurge and might have missed some stuff. Bad Beast, not prepared.

  7. The Beast Must Die Says:

    Oh yeah – I liked the bit where the big beefy Dothraki ripped he other one’s tngue out through his severed throat for shit talking his wife.

  8. Adam Says:

    (Westerosi are people from Westeros. Westeros is where all the stuff that isn’t the Dany/Dothraki stuff is set. Jorah is a disgraced Westerosi knight)

  9. amypoodle Says:

    Yeah, and, apart from his voice which is irksome but you get used to it after a bit, I didn’t mind Jorah being a mouthpiece for exposition. It actually makes sense that someone would have to unpack the Dothraki for Dany. The sexposition, which obvs has been discussed beyond the point of it being interesting, is much more clunky than anything Jorah says.

    I don’t agree that the Dothraki are always rubbish. The scenes involving the handmaidens (sans Hollyoaks) are often pretty good, as are the scenes with the focal bloodrider (whatever his name is).

  10. Adam Says:

    Gary, I think the claim that people can choose whether or not to be bothered, while in some sense true, privileges subjectivity a little too much. If you don’t like the legacy of Empire and you’re not keen on the monarchy, there’s a sense in which Moz accepting on MBE is an objectively bad thing in that it helps to perpetuate the whole shebang. Helps in a small way to be sure, but as with everything the small battles need to be fought.

    Whether it’s a betrayal of his stated ideals is another question entirely. Don’t reckon it is.

  11. tam Says:

    Haven’t read the Hunger Games, but by all accounts if you like that then you ought to check out the original novel of Battle Royale, (from which the film, manga, etc all came) which is the best piece of page-turning pulp fiction I’ve ever read and worth checking out even if you’ve seen the film.

    What possessed The Beast to reside in Gary’s right sleeve? Isn’t that just asking for mucky trouble? In my experience, staying in the host’s left sleeve is usually a much safer and hygienic bet.

  12. The Beast Must Die Says:

    Jesus do I know that now!

  13. Stephen Williamson Says:

    Lords of the Aether: Why not bring in Bobsy while Gary and Lady Lactus facilitate their cosmic union?

  14. Stephen Williamson Says:

    Also: Hibe has confirmed (either on twitter or on his blog) that there will at least be a follow-up Bulletproof Coffin one-shot sometime later this year.

  15. Adam Says:

    Faithful listeners, Gary informed me this very morning of his plans to get married AND produce not one but two pulse pulverising podcasts.

    The dream is still alive. All you have to do is believe.

  16. tam Says:

    By the way, I think you ought to revive your ‘shoulda known better’ feature to cover The Comedian #1. The first two Before Watchmen books were merely incredibly underwhelming, but judging by these preview pages, The Comedian looks thrillingly awful enough to qualify for worst comic of the year.

  17. Stephen Williamson Says:

    Mars Attacks was pretty terrible as well…

  18. amypoodle Says:

    So, um, not only does the Comedian kill Monroe, but also Kennedy. And, oh the tragedy, he loved him.

    Fucking hell.

  19. Carey Says:

    Regarding Morrison’s MBE, it may mean more to him than most because his father was given one as well, as detailed in Morrison Sr’s obituary here:

    And, in all honesty, if someone as libertarian and subversive as Walter Morrison would accept an MBE then I can fully believe his son would as well.

    Of course, Grant may also be looking to outdo his father’s quip to the queen regarding shooting her corgis….

  20. The Beast Must Die Says:

    I fear that I will be reading some Tony Daniel’s Detective Comics for ‘Should’ve Known Better’ rather than the Comedian (although it looks FUCKING AWESOME and I’M SUPER-PSYCHED to read it!).

    The Daniels thing came to be in a dream, and you have to listen to dreams no matter how stupid they are.

  21. Gary Lactus Says:

    I came in a dream the other night.

  22. Gary Lactus Says:


  23. The Beast Must Die Says:

    Yeah, it was a dream about your Momma.


  24. igmus Says:

    Yeah, first and foremost the Morrison MBE thing does remind me of the “hero” theme, which you guys mentioned first off as well.

    I think I’m not pissed about it primarily because Morrison stopped being sort of a “hero” of mine several years ago. Corroborating that is the simple fact that I’m a little younger than you guys and never really “grew up with” Morrison’s comics in the first place. (Never read more than a handful of Invisibles until the whole series was done.)

    Like others have said, I still really like Morrison and will likely continue to read most of the work he puts out. But at this point whenever Morrison — his work or news about him — attempts to crossover into the real world as I experience it, I just frankly can’t take it too seriously, unfortunately.

    I suppose that Morrison for all his wild creativity — and in some sense BECAUSE of all his wild creativity — just seems fundamentally flawed or fundamentally unrealistic or something. So it becomes a bit of a problem whenever reality and Morrison cross paths. Because ultimately the Reality Principle always wins, and it makes Morrison look silly (or less awesome) in the process.

    Part of me really wishes that he would stop being so silly in many respects: I wish he’d put the superheroes away a bit more often, and I wish he’d get serious about certain things instead of hiding behind whimsical rationalizations and wacky interpretations of unpleasant matters.

    Example: When he talks (as he does so fucking often) about Superman the character being bigger and better than real people — after a while I begin to suspect that he’s just saying this in order to convince himself that it’s perfectly fine for him to remain (on certain points) stunted as a creator. He still is excessively, nostalgically obsessed with DC superheroes, so he needs an excuse to keep writing about them. Unfortunately the excuse he’s chosen (“[The idea of] Superman is better than [REAL] people”) is dubious at best. And at worst it’s actually really fucking insulting to the human race. (Personally I believe that at least a good 4% of us have lives that are more emotionally and intellectually valuable than Superman the series of soulless ink blotches.)

    In a similar way, I just feel that whatever whimsical/fourth-wall-bending excuse Morrison is sure to make regarding his MBE will just be, ultimately, a bit uninteresting and dubious. However interesting his creative spins are on these issues, they’re certainly inferior to what would happen if he’d just put the Superman dolly away, finally, and say “Yeah, an MBE is a joke and I DON’T want one. Nor do I want to write so much for DC anymore. Especially since I peaked on superheroes quite a while ago. Sorry for taking so long to grow up, guys. But I’m done with my Oedipus-complex-war against Alan Moore now; I don’t feel the need to keep asserting that superheroes are always good and happy and infinitely valuable, even though my personal fallen hero stopped thinking so 15 years ago.”

    At the risk of sounding egomaniacal myself, I certainly don’t think I need Grant Morrison as a hero as much as Morrison says he needs Superman as a hero. Any maybe that’s the crux of the matter. How many of us ageing comics readers (I’m 30) really need Superman and Batman as real HEROES in our lives anymore on any level that matters? Grown-ups don’t really need heroes in that regard. I admit, actually, that during Morrison’s Batman 3-4 years ago, I really found Bruce overcoming the Black Glove to be inspiring, sure. But, as a deeply personal hero? Not quite. Not even then. Yet so much of Morrison’s effort goes toward insisting that regular humans (real people) NEED to look up and endlessly supinely worship blatantly, transparently imperfect “super-heroes”. And I think that says a lot more about Morrison’s own psychology (creative genius though he is) than our own.

    Lastly, about the Morrison Con, thing: Again, to me the distasteful aspect of this is that it’s just more ridiculously overblown hero worship (and commercialization). It wasn’t Morrison’s idea, no. But he’s basically encouraging the Celebrity of it all — which is a theeme that seems quite obviously, societally unhealthy and distasteful. And, worse than that, a bit fucking boring and gimmicky. Ron from iFanboy is a great guy, a fun guy, and I like him. Always enjoyed him; hope he makes a lot of money. But iFanboy has never done anything approaching a literary understanding of Morrison — they are into comics solely for the hype and the Celebrity of it all. Meanwhile they post headline news about funny things that Scott Snyder tweets, and have named Snyder’s Batman Pick of the Week like five times already. Again, not that any of those things are “bad”, but it’s a far cry from something I’d want to get behind and champion or whatever.

    And, really, it’s just kind of disappointing — if not unexpected — that Morrison isn’t a bit BETTER than all of the above. I wish he was less Stan Lee and more Alan Moore.

    Sorry if it seems like I’m bitching too much. I lost one contact, so I’ve had to type all this with one eye closed. A bit exhausted, too. Will return with prompter, funnier, happier comments next Silence!.

  25. amypoodle Says:

    I don’t know that he’d give a fourth wall bending reason for excepting the MBE though. To him it might not seem like he has to explain himself. I think Lactus’s reasoning probably gets quite close to Morrison’s. He’s always been more of an aesthete than a moralist.

    I was saying in the emails that when it comes to Morrison’s writing I’m firmly NOT in the ‘he needs to get back to the creator owned stuff’ camp – because, no, he doesn’t, he needs to write whatever it is that he enjoys. That’s why I like his Batman comics, because he clearly enjoys creating them.

    That said, I’m not sure he’s feeling Superman very much at all, and maybe that signifies that when he’s done with Inc the guy should put the heroes to bed. I guess it’s difficult, because it’s been a long time since the nineties and the spaceships don’t look they’re going to arrive…. What do you write about now?

    Scary times. But could be amazing. He just needs to find the balls to face this stuff head on.

  26. Adam Says:

    I don’t really do heroes. There are creators whose work I like a lot, and creators whose work I like less, and creators whose work I don’t like, but none of these positions are necessarily static. In short, it’s the work that counts. I’m only interested in public statements by creators when they’re actually interesting or when they’re actually horrid, and only in extreme cases will that affect my attitude to their creative output, in part because the work is often better, wiser, more beautiful, innovative, etc… (or the converse) than anything a creator is likely to say.

    I think All Star Superman has some important things to say. I don’t think Supergods does.

  27. ian B Says:

    I enjoyed the (probably unintended) juxtaposition of the queen and Stan Lee above. Certainly I think Stan is worthy of a Jubilee year shortly.

    Is not an MBE an no-prize in a dress suit?

    I no which I would prefer.

    My personal view of the queen is that there is no such thing. It’s just an old lady dressing up and playing lets pretend; she is, in Morrisonian language, a para personality in a collaborative fiction which has successfully invaded reality.

    Grant’s acceptance of a royal no prize is his entry into fictionality and is entirely consistent with his normal game.

  28. Adam Says:


  29. ian B Says:

    Sorry Adam, was really commenting on an earlier post rather than yours. One of Morrison’s consistent themes is the interchange between fiction and reality. He has moved himself into fiction, and claims to have brought characters from fiction into reality.

    I was drawing parallels with that process and the process by which a formerly young woman called Elizabeth Windsor became a fictional entity called the queen.

    The surprise that Grant Morrison accepted an token award from her is understandable not in terms of his relationship with authority but in terms of his interest in the process of crossing between fiction and reality.

    The Stan Lee stuff was just for fun.

    Unless your ‘?’ indicates your believe that there is really such a thing as a queen.

  30. amypoodle Says:


    I’ll let Ad deal with this one….

  31. Thrills Says:

    Bah, had to skip the bits about LOEG and also Prometheus as I haven’t read/seen them yet. I suck.

    The Malcolm Mclaren comparison with Morrison is a good one, likes. He’s just a pop cultural maverick sort of guy who is interesting and sometimes kind of a jerk?

    I’m in the “He used to mean SO MUCH TO ME but now I recognise he’s just someone I like that makes ace comics” phase of my life. I suppose it’s all part of hitting my 30s? Like how getting over the Manics was part of hitting my 20s?

    Granto’s at the Glasgow Comic con on saturday, so maybe he’ll shed some light on the whole MBE thing, there. I’m missing Pride in Edinburgh for it, so I HOPE HE’S HAPPY (I’m mainly missing Pride as my comic’s up for some awards at the Glasgow con, but. Just thought I’d shoehorn that in).

  32. Gary Lactus Says:

    Gongratzz on the nom, Thrills. Let us know what Grant has to say.

  33. Adam Says:

    Go thrillz

  34. Thrills Says:

    Ocht, cheers, folks!

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